Sage Counters, Tiers I to III

[FelishannaSecretlight]

OOC.

Yesterday evening, I was spell-scribing, and decided to actually check each buff again and then write down it's observed effect and cost. Note that this is of Friday 14th January 2005, at about 11pm GMT (in case they change things again, please I hope not!!).

Key:
DUR = Durability
PRG = Progress
PWR = Power
SC = Success Chance (magnitude of this always unknown)

Arcana Tier I Counters
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Spellbinding -9 DUR +21 PRG
Notation +14 PRG -SC
Lettering +6 PRG, -6% PWR

Arcana Tier II Counters
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Spellweaving +15 DUR, -30 PRG
Jot Down +10 DUR, -SC
Caligraphy +10 DUR, -14% PWR

Arcana Tier III Counters
===============

Incantation -9 DUR, +21 PRG
Records +7 PRG -SC
Scribing +18 PRG, -13% PWR

Arcana Tier IV Counters
===============

Chant +5 DUR, -10 PRG
Scripting +10 DUR, -SC
Penmanship +15 DUR, -16.5% PWR

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Addendum: Added Tier IV buffs now. All seem to be the same, as on Sunday 30/01/2005.

.

[CyclopsSlayer]

<mutter><mutter>

I carefully log these all one day, and a few days later it's all different, well, parts are different. Need to do up some more inks and test these all out again.... again...

Arcana Tier I Counters
==============
Spellbinding -9 DUR + 21 PRG

Arcana Tier III Counters
==============
Incantation -9 DUR, +21 PRG

Have you been able to decipher the why of having two identical buffs in the same line, 2 tiers apart? /boggle

[Gojira]

Speaking of counters etc.

What counters do you guys suggest or find to work best for spell scribing?

I've somewhat avoided scribing much since the patch, as it costs me to much to "Experiment" with the new system. I'm about 50/50 in Apprentice IV's on the 6 attempts I've made. Not a good ratio I think.

I've got Alchemy figured out, but that's much cheaper to work on.

I usually go with two relatively low cost buffs to increase durability, one high durability counter with moderate cost for emergencies and one Progress for Power buff for when I'm near the end and have high durability anyway just to speed things up.

Are there certain counters or events that shouldn't have more than one effect tossed in? (Like in Alchemy, I find that if I get a book event, it's best to counter with a book and leave the other two skills out for that tick.)

[Bakual]

Have you been able to decipher the why of having two identical buffs in the same line, 2 tiers apart? /boggle

The effect of countering an event with this may be different. I did not test this yet but will :)

[Llayena]

While it is only my theory, and I prepare to get shot down, the purpose of the higher spells is that you are suppose to eliminate the lower.

When you get your second set of progress spells, you no longer need your tier ones. When you get your second set of durability spells, you no longer need your tier twos. If you place your cursor over the spells, you will note the color, i.e., grey yellow orange. It is the same with your adventure spells/abilities. As you outgrow the lower level ones, they are replaced with better spells.

[CyclopsSlayer]

While it is only my theory, and I prepare to get shot down, the purpose of the higher spells is that you are suppose to eliminate the lower.

When you get your second set of progress spells, you no longer need your tier ones. When you get your second set of durability spells, you no longer need your tier twos. If you place your cursor over the spells, you will note the color, i.e., grey yellow orange. It is the same with your adventure spells/abilities. As you outgrow the lower level ones, they are replaced with better spells.

True, and I believe that that may well have been the intent. In practice there is no difference with the counters con color I can detect.

If the t1's stopped working, then there would be plenty of reason to stop using them, as it is there is no reason to drop them.

[Viliarna]

True, and I believe that that may well have been the intent. In practice there is no difference with the counters con color I can detect.

If the t1's stopped working, then there would be plenty of reason to stop using them, as it is there is no reason to drop them.
Yes, I think the plan as originally set up was to have one of two things happen:

1. Using Tradeskill Arts would not always be successful; the possibility of success would be dependent upon your level compared to the level of the Art, or

2. Tradeskill Arts would have increasingly better results as you increased your level, but with caps for Arts that become trivial to you, much like Spells.

Whatever they intended, they haven't produced a system that implements it, yet. As it stands, using Tier 3 Arts is no different than using Tier 1 Arts; the same effect upon progress, durability and (so far as we know) success chance occur. Using the Tier 1 Art that causes power loss is often much more effective than the Tier 3 Art, because you lose less power for the same result. :)

This aspect to the game is so primitive, as I understand it, because the whole tradeskilling system wasn't adopted until very late in the beta testing. I think that the powers that be didn't realize just how interested the players would be in the idea of a truly working economy. My bet is that, when we look at it in a year, it will be much more fun to use, much more logically consistent, and much better thought out. Our input will help this progress; we are the pioneers of the game in this area. :)

Yah, Mule, Yah!! :D

[Fellstrike]

I saw this thread on the counters, and thought I might add a lil tidbit. I have a sage and an alchemist both level 26. Prior to recent patches I was extremely proactive in buffing between ticks....however, in tier 3 I noticed that the loss of durability buffs killed my % of pristine rate. I was irate lol didn't tradeskill for like 2 weeks.

When i started back up I took a different approach. Rather than be the mad clicker that i had been in the past, I decided to roll with punches only countering when needed. Also when the pristine durability bar drops below 60ish %, i buff tier 2 durability buffs as well as the lil tier 2 pink icon. Using all three tier 2 icons if landed between ticks land +25 +20 about 90% of the time.

Using this method i began to see many of those 100+ progress with no durability movement results. Both my alchemist and sage follow this pattern now and will untill the return of durability buffs in tier 4. =)

My pristine rate is now back to a healthy 90-94% success rate even with even con discovery combines. Dinged 26 on sage just last night after making 22 spells straight app 4. I don't know if this advice will help anyone, but if it takes at least some of the agitation out of someones mood today, I'll be happy!